Topic: [REJECTED] Monster Hunter BUR

The bulk update request #592 has been rejected.

Reason: For the "monster_hunter_stories -> monster_hunter" alias, I suggest this because every other title from the franchise has undergone the same alias treatment.

For the species script lines:

• Glave's to Kirin's: Seems like most subspecies/variants without sufficient independent images are simply aliased to the primary monster.
• Tigrex's to Tobi's: Implications that seem worthwhile instead of aliasing.
• Desert Seltas': Doesn't seem necessary to have these implications when there are no images of either desert versions. I think they should just be aliased instead.
• Conga's to Io's: Following the same logic behind other pack monsters, the alphas should be aliased to the lesser betas. Examples include velociprey/velocidrome, jaggi/great_jaggi, and blango/blangonga
• Great_Maccao/Maccao: The former is already aliased to the latter, so the implication seems superfluous.
• Canyne: As of now I don't know if this counts is a lynian, so I'm just having it imply monster_hunter (gore_magala is another example of such an unclassified monster).
• Rath's: These lines should clean up the mishmash of implications going on between all the rath tags. With this it'll be in a proper implication tree.

I'm unsure why some subspecies/variants are aliased and why others are implied, so I just went ahead and made my best judgement for some parts of the script. I can change it based on input. Hopefully there's no errors in all this, because damn it took a long time to sift through all these tags.
Edit: Forgot to add the rath stuff

Related forum post: topic #27554

EDIT: The bulk update request #592 (forum #303079) has been rejected by @slyroon.

dedari said:
Reason: For the "monster_hunter_stories -> monster_hunter" alias, I suggest this because every other title from the franchise has undergone the same alias treatment.

May want to add a monster_hunter_rise alias as well.

Also, I wonder if various tags like bird_wyvern, fanged_wyvern, flying_wyvern, etc, should be aliased away. They're not necessarily "true" wyverns (what e6 would tag as such), and are more like classifications ala flying-type, fighting-type, and dragon-type pokemon, which don't get tagged since they aren't TWYS.

watsit said:
May want to add a monster_hunter_rise alias as well.

Also, I wonder if various tags like bird_wyvern, fanged_wyvern, flying_wyvern, etc, should be aliased away. They're not necessarily "true" wyverns (what e6 would tag as such), and are more like classifications ala flying-type, fighting-type, and dragon-type pokemon, which don't get tagged since they aren't TWYS.

Monster_Hunter_Rise already has a pending alias which is why I didn't include it in the BUR. See the linked forum post.
As per your second point, I'm not sure what you think the wyvern tags should be aliased to. Wyvern_(monster_hunter) perhaps?

dedari said:
As per your second point, I'm not sure what you think the wyvern tags should be aliased to. Wyvern_(monster_hunter) perhaps?

Just to monster_hunter, same as how bug_pokémon is aliased to pokémon. Monster Hunter seems to use "wyvern" to mean a generic "monster", and the different types of wyverns are just different classifications of monsters which don't have much visual consistency.

watsit said:
Just to monster_hunter, same as how bug_pokémon is aliased to pokémon. Monster Hunter seems to use "wyvern" to mean a generic "monster", and the different types of wyverns are just different classifications of monsters which don't have much visual consistency.

This is a good point. I don't know if the mods want to do this, but I'll type up some of the needed script here if that's what is going to be done instead.

Lynian and Canyne might be fine on their own, but I can add those to the section as well. Also, in such a task, would all of the independent monster species need to be unimplied from their "wyvern" parent tag and switched over to "monster_hunter"? How does all that work out on the backend?
Eg. Would bird_wyvern and jaggi need to undergo the following:

If the example script needs to be done, there's gonna need to be a massive BUR to fix it all.

watsit said:
Just to monster_hunter, same as how bug_pokémon is aliased to pokémon. Monster Hunter seems to use "wyvern" to mean a generic "monster", and the different types of wyverns are just different classifications of monsters which don't have much visual consistency.

Yeah, that seems to be the way to go. However, there are also other "types" as well, like Fanged Beasts, etc. (see MH Wiki ), which would make me wonder how the bulk alias would look like.

I have also raised other concerns on another thread before. Like what should we do to the Elder_Dragon tag since it is also a "type" of monster class. Should we alias away or keep separate (like with Legendary_Pokémon)?

And then there is the alternate forms and subspecies as well (like pink_rathian/gold_rathian, azure_rathalos/silver_rathalos, etc).

thegreatwolfgang said:
I have also raised other concerns on another thread before. Like what should we do to the Elder_Dragon tag since it is also a "type" of monster class. Should we alias away or keep separate (like with Legendary_Pokémon)?

It would make sense to treat them the same way. If legendary_pokémon stays, elder_dragon (or elder_dragon_(mh)) should as well. Or if legendary_pokémon should go, elder_dragon should also. One could argue that since they only cover a specific set of unique-ish special monsters, usually more grandiose in appearance, it's useful enough for searching while others like bug_pokémon or fanged_wyvern are a bit too generic.

thegreatwolfgang said:
And then there is the alternate forms and subspecies as well (like pink_rathian/gold_rathian, azure_rathalos/silver_rathalos, etc).

Taking pokémon as an example, alternate official colorations are placed under the shiny_pokémon umbrella tag. alternate_colors doesn't seem appropriate if it's an official color scheme, but if Monster Hunter doesn't have a blanket term for these alternate schemes, having the specific tags may be the best option. With alternate forms, pokémon does have specific tags for those, like land_forme_shaymin and origin_forme_giratina (no idea why it's forme instead of form, though).

thegreatwolfgang said:
Yeah, that seems to be the way to go. However, there are also other "types" as well, like Fanged Beasts, etc. (see MH Wiki ), which would make me wonder how the bulk alias would look like.

Fanged Beasts, or primatius as it's used on this site, could also just be aliased to Monster_Hunter as well. I think we've just been using wyvern as a generic term for the broad classification of Monster Hunter species since it's the most common. Stuff like herbivore_(mh), leviathan_(mh), and neopteron would presumably undergo the same alias treatment.

thegreatwolfgang said:
And then there is the alternate forms and subspecies as well (like pink_rathian/gold_rathian, azure_rathalos/silver_rathalos, etc).

If need be those could just be aliased to their parent monster type. Gold_Rathian would just default to Rathian, for example. However, unlike pokemon, the subspecies are technically distinct monsters unlike shiny's which are basically just a palette swap. Nothing about a pokemon changes when it's shiny besides its looks unless things have changed. As I've mentioned before though, there doesn't really seem to be any rhyme or reason for why some subspecies get aliased and others get implications. From what I can tell so far it's just whether or not the subspecies is popular enough (ie. plenty of images featuring it) to deserve its own independent tag.

Rath_wyvern needs to decide early on what to do.
This tag does not belong to any super concept (nor monster_hunter).

It may be good to divide only this and do it first.

The bulk update request #592 (forum #303079) has been rejected by @slyroon.