Topic: Should firearm model tags be under the "copyright" category?

I've been wondering, if tags mentioning firearms by the explicit model name, should be under the copyright category.

Not talking about generic terms like pistol or assault_rifle, I mean explicit terms like beretta_92 or hk416.

The site already seems to have established a standard for, in example, tagging vehicles under the copyright category, like the bmw_m3 or mercedes-benz_c63. This also seems to apply for other appliances, computers like the amiga_500 or phones like the google_pixel.

I feel like for consistency's sake, it would make sense to also put firearms that are named under said category. What's the general consensus on that?

I've brought up that question before and there doesn't seem to be a real answer.
This issue also extends beyond specific firearms models and into specific vehicle models and military branches/medals/emblems.

IMO, the copyright tag should only be used for "recognizable brands and franchises" and not specific objects (see e621:tags#categories_copyright and e621:tag types).

thegreatwolfgang said:
I've brought up that question before and there doesn't seem to be a real answer.
This issue also extends beyond specific firearms models and into specific vehicle models and military branches/medals/emblems.

IMO, the copyright tag should only be used for "recognizable brands and franchises" and not specific objects (see e621:tags#categories_copyright and e621:tag types).

It could be argued that certain brands and models of firearms are very famous and recognizable (the Colt M1911, FN P90, and AK-47 come to mind). They also have distinct looks.

I also would like us to make a formal decision on this, as I've been working on tagging manufacturers/brands. With aircraft and cars there already seemed to be an established convention but for firearms it's all over the place. I don't have a particularly strong opinion on whether they should be general or copyright however

mklxiv said:
It could be argued that certain brands and models of firearms are very famous and recognizable (the Colt M1911, FN P90, and AK-47 come to mind). They also have distinct looks.

The Mjolnir and Lightsaber are also very famous and recognisable, but they are in the general category.

I believe the brand/franchise's copyright would be sufficient while objects within said copyright should just be general tags.*
^{* Obvious exceptions for when the brand's name is synonymous with the objects, such as Crocs or Red_Bull.}

lust_demon_laz said:
I also would like us to make a formal decision on this, as I've been working on tagging manufacturers/brands. With aircraft and cars there already seemed to be an established convention but for firearms it's all over the place. I don't have a particularly strong opinion on whether they should be general or copyright however

I'm for turning all physical objects to the general category, with the exception mentioned above.
Popular media, software, and games would also be exempt (e.g., Google made Google_Chrome).

thegreatwolfgang said:
The Mjolnir and Lightsaber are also very famous and recognisable, but they are in the general category.

In these specific examples mjolnir should really implicate norse_mythology and lightsaber already implicates star_wars specifically (a generic, non-Star-Wars weapon of that type is a laser sword, as mentioned on the wiki).

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what is being wanted here.

thegreatwolfgang said:
I believe the brand/franchise's copyright would be sufficient while objects within said copyright should just be general tags.

What about things that are both physical objects as well as a brand the other objects are under? e.g. nintendo_switch is an object, a physical console that you interact with to use, but is also a kind of branding that applies to other related things, like the switch_pro_controller or the logo without the console itself visible.

Honestly, it's always felt weird that a tag for the console itself also applies to accessories or the console branding without the console visible.

mklxiv said:
Maybe I'm misunderstanding what is being wanted here.

Objects should not be in the copyright category, IMO.

watsit said:
What about things that are both physical objects as well as a brand the other objects are under? e.g. nintendo_switch is an object, a physical console that you interact with to use, but is also a kind of branding that applies to other related things, like the switch_pro_controller or the logo without the console itself visible.

Honestly, it's always felt weird that a tag for the console itself also applies to accessories or the console branding without the console visible.

The Nintendo_Switch can be either the brand name itself or a physical object, and thus would be exempt like I mentioned and be kept as a copyright tag.

As for the individual physical objects associated with the brand (e.g., switch_console, switch_charger, joycon_controller, etc.), they should absolutely NOT be all turned into copyright tags.

thegreatwolfgang said:
Objects should not be in the copyright category, IMO.

The Nintendo_Switch can be either the brand name itself or a physical object, and thus would be exempt like I mentioned and be kept as a copyright tag.

As for the individual physical objects associated with the brand (e.g., switch_console, switch_charger, joycon_controller, etc.), they should absolutely NOT be all turned into copyright tags.

So for example, ford_mustang would be in copyright as it's a recognizable sub-brand of ford while ford_crown_victoria would be in the general category? Or are you proposing to put all ford_* in the general category?

Edit: just trying to clarify so I can understand better

On the topic of the firearms themselves, how do we feel about appending _(firearm) or _(gun) to the end of the models? Specifically I'm thinking of ones that are just letter/number strings to make it easier for people unfamiliar with them to know at a glance what the tag means without having to go to a typically blank wiki or draw conclusions from other images in the tag?

It's something I've thought about a few times as I've been adding manufacturer tags

I'm not suggesting that we do it for every firearm, I think ak-47, m1911, ar-15 and such are well known enough that they wouldn't need the suffex, I'm more talking about stuff like f2000, sks, pgm_hecate_ii

lust_demon_laz said:
So for example, ford_mustang would be in copyright as it's a recognizable sub-brand of ford while ford_crown_victoria would be in the general category? Or are you proposing to put all ford_* in the general category?

Edit: just trying to clarify so I can understand better

If the Ford_Mustang or the Ford_Crown_Victoria (as in the entire lineup, not the models) is significant enough to have its own distinct branding and logo, then it can stay as its own copyright tag.
Otherwise, implying them under Ford would be more than sufficient. As for their individual car models, they don't all need to be copyright tags.

lust_demon_laz said:
On the topic of the firearms themselves, how do we feel about appending _(firearm) or _(gun) to the end of the models? Specifically I'm thinking of ones that are just letter/number strings to make it easier for people unfamiliar with them to know at a glance what the tag means without having to go to a typically blank wiki or draw conclusions from other images in the tag?

It's something I've thought about a few times as I've been adding manufacturer tags

I'm not suggesting that we do it for every firearm, I think ak-47, m1911, ar-15 and such are well known enough that they wouldn't need the suffex, I'm more talking about stuff like f2000, sks, pgm_hecate_ii

I don't believe that is necessary, unless they are generic or vague in naming.

• 1) All firearms should be attached with their respective brands/manufacturers (e.g., f2000 should be renamed to fn_f2000 instead).
• 2) Vague names consisting of generic letters or simple abbreviations should be disambiguated and substituted with a suffix or their full designation (e.g., RPG meaning role-playing_game or rocket_launcher/RPG-7? PKM meaning Pokemon or pkm_(machine_gun)?).